Fav quotes

[Travis Retriever]

http://reason.com/archives/2013/11/24/property-and-force-a-reply-to-matt-bruen

That was Matt Bruen's main point?  A thinly veiled rehash of "well what counts as force is subjective, hur dur!"?  Whoa, leave some of that originality for us, there, captain ambitious!

[ArtemisVale]

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[AnCap Dave]

As a wrestling fan, all I can say is A-FUCKING-MEN!

[ArtemisVale]

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[Travis Retriever]

Dear "HUR DUR FIRST WORLD PROBLEMS!" fucktards--chew on this:
http://www.cracked.com/article_20684_5-everyday-annoyances-that-are-actually-worldwide-disasters.html
Note everything on this list is either directly related to government, in something govco has strict control over, or is flat out caused by government.  Well, okay, with the possible exception of weather forecasts.  Though I don't it's helping at the very least...

[BlameThe1st]

Considering how atheist organizations are currently trying to force churches to pay taxes, this video seems relevant, and a poignant explanation as to why this shouldn't be:

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[dallen68]

Considering how atheist organizations are currently trying to force churches to pay taxes, this video seems relevant, and a poignant explanation as to why this shouldn't be:

[yt]f8Hy306pGmU[/yt]

Didn't watch the video. Your church SHOULD pay taxes BECAUSE of separation of church and state. Pretending the assets belong to the sky dictator doesn't grant you special privileges. If you want to make an argument based on whatever humanitarian services your church provides; okay, but then you have to have all the same reporting/regulation that any secular organization that was providing those services would have. Also, like those organizations, the way it should be is: What you use to operate the organization, and actually provide services is tax exempt; the pastor's salary ISN'T.

Also, I can't think of an "atheist organization" trying to "force" this. At most, there's random people on the internet, like myself, expressing an OPINION about it. The "atheist organizations" are mostly stopping you from having "church" in city hall, and stuff like that.

[Travis Retriever]

Solution--just abolish taxation so what the church has isn't special treatment anymore.  Bam, easiest thing in the history of forever.

[dallen68]

Which doesn't address the issue at hand. There's an earth-shattering difference between "let's not have taxes, or regulations, or government", and "let's not have the taxes, regulations, and government that applies to everybody else apply to me because...snow elves."

[Travis Retriever]

Which doesn't address the issue at hand

Taxation is the issue.  So yes, yes it does.  Deal with it.

There's an earth-shattering difference between "let's not have taxes, or regulations, or government", and "let's not have the taxes, regulations, and government that applies to everybody else apply to me because...snow elves."

In one case you have a group not being subjected to institutionalized robbery (taxes) because they belong to a group, and another where said institutionalized robbery isn't a thing.  That *is* the issue and how you solve the issue of it being 'special treatment'.  If it's special treatment to not rape some group or people, the solution isn't to therefore rape them along with everyone else, the solution is to just not rape anyone.

[dallen68]

Taxation is the issue.  So yes, yes it does.  Deal with it.
In one case you have a group not being subjected to institutionalized robbery (taxes) because they belong to a group, and another where said institutionalized robbery isn't a thing.  That *is* the issue and how you solve the issue of it being 'special treatment'.  If it's special treatment to not rape some group or people, the solution isn't to therefore rape them along with everyone else, the solution is to just not rape anyone.

No taxes for everyone is not what's being asked for by the proponents of tax-exempt status for churches, so NO, NO IT DON'T. Deal with it.

I can't believe you even brought rape up. I consider that a Hitler argument.

[Travis Retriever]

No taxes for everyone is not what's being asked for by the proponents of tax-exempt status for churches, so NO, NO IT DON'T. Deal with it.

Then they're special pleading for those they don't want taxed.  Which doesn't exactly help you or the OP.

I can't believe you even brought rape up. I consider that a Hitler argument.

Don't your panties in a twist, it was a legitimate example of initiated force, used to illustrate the point.

[tnu]

guys? is this going to be going on for a while?

[dallen68]

Then they're special pleading for those they don't want taxed. 

Which is the point

Don't your panties in a twist, it was a legitimate example of initiated force, used to illustrate the point.

I understood what you were trying to say; if there was some world where everyone in the population was subject to rape, except...those people...it would be a legitmate example. Since there isn't, it's not.

[evensgrey]

I understood what you were trying to say; if there was some world where everyone in the population was subject to rape, except...those people...it would be a legitmate example. Since there isn't, it's not.

I don't think you understand the point being made at all.

The purpose of using an obviously wrong action as an example is to illustrate WHY the solution for a situation in which there are people exempted from a wrong is to remove the wrong, not the exemption.  George Carlin wasn't being more moral by advocating the taxation of churches, he was being more consistently immoral.