Venus Project Fail

[Travis Retriever]

Again, more for laughs and mockery than for actual rebuttal.  I've seen cult behavior before, but..damn.
I saw this on a another site:
"Now, I'm not going to go onto his profile and start spamming him with links. However, I figured I would post both what it said on his profile page, followed by links of videos refuting the Venus Project in its entirety.

'Imagine a world beyond poverty, politics, crime and war.
A world without money... Is it even possible?
www.thevenusproject.com '

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlWVtSpbovs ('Re: Critique of the book: "Economics In One Lesson", debunking Capitalism - Pt. 6')
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=je6RqN1uN3s ('Why Energy "Credits" from Zeigeist: Addenum will never work...')
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXZu4sqzp80 ('Corrections and further criticisms of the Venus project')
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rk6boW8vnB8 ('Technological "unemployment" is horseshit...')
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pe0YrCeiazw ('Technological "unemployment" is horseshit... part 2')
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qkks0S4_s4Q ('Re: Technological "unemployment" is horseshit... part 2')
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KwULX3TQ4T0 ('Re: Venus Project's Fallacies')
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8SGMut2Am4 ('What is the price mechanism?')

A ton of videos, I know, but they're good ones.
Also, yes, I'm aware that the person explaining this stuff tends to be a bit confusing, but if you can understand the gist of what he's saying, it's a devastating rebuttal to the idea.

EDIT/UPDATE:
'I just Wiki'd it and saw this: "The project was founded on the idea that poverty is caused by the stifling of progress in technology, which itself is caused by the present world's profit-driven economic system."

Here we have a BIG problem: the desire for profit is the CAUSE of technological advancement! It doesn't stifle it! And the risks involved with innovating new technology are so great that I don't see how anyone WOULD do it without a profit motive.' Shane Killian"

The first Neo-Luddite's reply:  "its ineffective for me to wiki "[the person's username on this site]" to find out all about you, rather than seeing you for myself.

I will have a very BIG response to this journal in the future, but for now, i have to get to work.

All i have to say is that the venus project has taken all the people that exist in the world and moved em to a storage box, and rebuilt the world to be a better place for 100% of human beings, with not 1 person left behind, with the dream that not 1 person will ever be killed through war or hatred, that racism will not exist, and it promotes the idea that all people are created equal, with equal heritage to everything the earth has to offer us, and has created a workable world that can make it all a reality, using science and technology, not fantasy. If these ideas seem wrong to you, i cant convince anyone otherwise, nor do i try to -- i try to find the people who agree with me already

Lastly, you dont really give any suggestions how to improve the world, and this entire journal is basically saying that profit causes technological advancement, things like technological unemployment dont exist (which is just funny), and that the world running the way it is, is perfect, the way it is. Summarily, the journal is just opposing the VP with no other goal or motive whatsoever.

Noone has to do a wiki search or a google brainstorm to figure out that the world is not perfect, that money is NOT good for us. And for you to say that you cant see how the world would work without a profit, thats just horrible.. There are many things i would do for good, and that others would do for good, from their heart, without wanting a profit from it. Tell that to the millions of people who volunteer everyday to help with natural disasters, to help feed the poor, to help clean our environment and save endangered species.

Zeitgeist I & II, along with the film, Future by Design open up so many doors and insights, i couldnt share em here.

Im sorry the venus project doesnt seem like a great idea to some."

The second Neo Luddite:  "Honestly this being my own opinion the world would move on successfully with out monetary involvement. Better technology is stifled by money. Think about it if cure research was giving what they needed with out money to hold back anything. Cures would be out on a weekly monthly basis.

As to technology taking jobs its already here. Machines do nearly 60% of the work we used to. But don't see it as oppression its more of a freedom one less horrible task we have to do. Machines are tools to help us to better easier lives.

People will always find something to do with out compensation. Honestly its money that makes people do it less cause they feel they'll never get anythign out of it. But what if doing it was its own reward. More people really would do it then.


in any form the Venus project is perfect but its simple better then what we have now."

I read both of their responses, and facepalmed.  If this isn't cult thinking, I don't know what is.

This comment to it was added (though not as a reply to either of them):  "Technological unemployment: http://jim.com/econ/chap07p1.html 'Economics in One Lesson' by Henry Hazlitt chapter 7: 'The Curse of Machinery'
I'd urge the two of them to read the entire book, however: http://jim.com/econ/ "

[Travis Retriever]

Just now, this has just been put on his journal:
"1. You said you'd reply to my journal about the Venus Project with a huge journal. How's that coming along.
2. Regarding that journal of mine, did you ever get around to watching the videos I put in it?"

His reply: "i said i'd follow up that topic with a journal of my own about the venus project

because of drama following my last posts i need to make sure i type that in perfectly so i can ensure everyone has a 100% chance to fully understand about what the venus project is, and is all about. This is something it took 3 books, about 6 movies, and over 50 hours of radio shows for me to grasp myself, for me to just scribble about it in a small journal. Im not sure if that post is coming along honestly, as im busy putting my own time and effort into the project itself and dealing with likeminded people, rather than convincing strangers what my personal life is all about."
Translation: "Rather than admit I don't have a leg to stand on to argue against Brede's (Ladyattis's) points, I'm just going to act like a snooty douche bag and walk away with my head up my ass, instead of admitting I am either wrong, or don't have non fallacious argument, or non emotional points."

"i watched every video you put in your journal"
Yet he didn't address any of Brede's points about anything.  He just spun things around, strawmanned both the OP and LadyAttis, pretended that, if the OP doesn't want to achieve those ideals via the Venus Project, he must therefore be against them, and went into a long intellectual equivalent of "NO U!" that said he wasn't going to rebut both Brede and the OP and has flopped on it.

And people wonder why I think they're cultists.

[Travis Retriever]

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Fucking win.

[Lord T Hawkeye]

Do refresh my rusty old memory.  What is the Venus Project in a nutshell?

[Travis Retriever]

Well, from what I recall, it is based around the idea that the emergent price system (profit/loss economy) is a huge cause of our problems.
E.g. Technological unemployment.
It's based on the idea that if we eliminate the monetary system and use a resource economy, we'll have huge technological advancement that will cure war, poverty and disease.
I'd recommend checking out ladyattis's videos on the subject.
He tears that movement a new one.

[VectorM]

It's communism with magic robots.

[Gumba Masta]

Maybe they should'nt have named it after an infernal hell hole of a planet

[Travis Retriever]

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Epic win.