Fav arguments against Ron Paul

[Lord T Hawkeye]

We've heard 'em all.  It really amazes me how much people dig to try and discredit the guy.  I remember when I saw him interviewed, he sure seemed like a pretty decent guy to me.  Maybe there's something I'm not getting but just for fun, let's share all the bogus arguments we've heard made against him and take pot shots.

I sent a couple to Shane a while back but this was probably the best one.

>     * Over 20 bills to reestablish the gold standard and close the
>       Federal Reserve bank. Some of his bills would even have us paying
>       our income taxes by mailing gold, not checks!

The guy's opposed to income tax so I don't really understand where they're getting that from.

Had a convo with a friend and he brought this one up too.  sadly, it was late and night and I can't remember what the bill was called or I'd cite it (it had the word family in it IIRC).  But all in all, he quoted a passage talking about "no government funding for councelling that promotes homosexuality as an acceptable lifestyle" or something to that nature.  (does this sound familiar to anyone who'd care to clarify because my memory is REALLY sketchy of this.)

Curious, I looked at the bill and for the most part, it all looked perfectly reasonable and the sort of thing I'd expect from Paul so this particular bit sounded out of place.  Anyone know more?

[MrBogosity]

Ron Paul's against government funding of most stuff. Of course they're going to cherry-pick to make him look bad.

[11mc22]

How about the dumb Ron Paul newsletter argument?
People calling him racist and stuff

[MrBogosity]

Yeah, or trying to lump him in with the creationists, saying things like, "Guarantee that he won't ever try to force creationism into schools!" And this is from SKEPTICS!!!

[Travis Retriever]

How about the dumb Ron Paul newsletter argument?
People calling him racist and stuff

Oh, I've heard of that.
I was told he (supposedily) funded, or allowed someone to fund a racist newletter.
It sounds like that's not true?
What's the whole story behind that one?

[MrBogosity]

There's a newsletter that bears his name: The Ron Paul Political Report. Awhile back, some racist articles appeared in an issue or two. Ron Paul wasn't even in the state at the time. He had no editorial oversight, and had not even seen the newsletter by the time it went out.

Details of who did it are sketchy, but the most likely culprit was a staffer named Eric Dondero Rittberg. Google him: he's infamous in libertarian circles. The man is a total nutcase who resorts to all sorts of despicable tactics against his enemies. He's one of the right-wing Republican infiltrators to the libertarian movement. He bleats on and on about having to destroy the "Islamofascists" and thinks that Rudy Giuliani is just the bee's knees.

Now, this newsletter stuff happened several years before Paul's presidential campaign. So during his campaign, a "Ron Paul insider" leaks this information to the media (it had already been discussed to death online years before, so it's not like it was any big secret). At first, this "insider" claims it was Paul himself who wrote it. When it came out that Paul wasn't even in the state, the "insider" then blamed Lew Rockwell (someone else Dondero has a beef with).

The interesting thing is, the racist articles stopped after Dondero was fired.

The other interesting thing is, the "insider" reporting this information to the press ended up being...Eric Dondero Rittberg.

So, you tell me.

[Travis Retriever]

Thanks for the information.
Not to mention how RP wanting to end the war on drugs, inflation, etc, as far as I can tell is about as anti-racist as you can get.  Perhaps these folks need to be basing these ideas on what the politicians do and vote for, as opposed to the guilt by association crap.

"Islamofascists"

Wait x5.
So what Pat Condell, CapnOAwesome, and them have been going on about has been either exaggerated, one sided or something?
I actually got into a debate with a guy named Liberty Student on the Mises forum about this.
I was going to make a separate thread, or put this into that thread where I saw that really wierd video talking about how Islamic people are reproducing like mad and "taking over the world" or something (I still can if you think it would be appropriate), but I figure since it was brought up here, I'll go into it.

Granted, I don't know how much of Islam's aggression to the West is caused (either directly or indirectly) by Western Interventionism.
That includes the riots to the Danish cartoons, etc.

[MrBogosity]

If you go poking at a hornet's nest, you're going to get stung. The solution is to LEAVE THE DAMN THING ALONE.

[Travis Retriever]

So this stuff (including the protests, etc) were, at the root, caused by interventionism?
I knew it...

[Travis Retriever]

Oh, but back on subject.
Another weird argument against him is that he's an Anarchist (or something like that.)

Another one:  his position of small government is not practical.

[Lord T Hawkeye]

It not only IS practical, it's been done before and worked.  Once upon a time, the US government just did a few basic things.  Kept a militia, maintained the courts and stuff like that and otherwise, left everyone alone.  Then came stuff like New Deal and all that and suddenly government gets seen as some kind of bottomless grab bag and now we're all footing the bill as will our children and grandchildren.

This is why I laugh at people who see libertarianism as some new, radical idea.  It's not new at all.  It's been around for decades.

And yes, the old "libertarianism = anarchist" argument.  I hear that one that all the time.  If someone gives you that one, demand that he look up both of them or you refuse to discuss the matter any further.

[Travis Retriever]

And yes, the old "libertarianism = anarchist" argument.  I hear that one that all the time.  If someone gives you that one, demand that he look up both of them or you refuse to discuss the matter any further.

Yeah, I've had it thrown at me.
The guy just said that both terms were used synonymous until recently and that I didn't know my history.

Which is funny because Anarchy until the 1800s (Lyansander Spooner) was mainly socialist/collectivistic (Anarcho Socialism/Communism/Syndaclists etc).  While Libertarianism is more about Free Markets and Small government.  In fact, in its current form it was made to replace liberal and conservative because both of those terms no longer apply to our founding fathers.
What's more, the only time I've ever heard it used otherwise is to describe socialism/communism style anarchy ("Left Libertarianism").

What's really ironic is that while he hate Thomas Jefferson and Ron Paul, he admires Noam Chomsky who, guess what:  Is an Anarcho Syndicalist.

[MrBogosity]

I've just been informed that on BlogTV, both Thunderf00t AND DPRJones equated libertarianism with anarchism.

Sometimes I wonder what's the point...

[Lord T Hawkeye]

I've just been informed that on BlogTV, both Thunderf00t AND DPRJones equated libertarianism with anarchism.

Sometimes I wonder what's the point...

Smug satisfaction when their realities finally come crashing down.

[Travis Retriever]

I've just been informed that on BlogTV, both Thunderf00t AND DPRJones equated libertarianism with anarchism.

Sometimes I wonder what's the point...

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR....
Darn it!