Stef's Video on Nelson Mandela

[Travis Retriever]

The talk about the USA founders reminds me of this video Stef made:

[yt]p25Rz2eP7s8[/yt]

[MrBogosity]

Washington did free his slaves in the end though, didn't he?

Only in his will, the only way he could. By the time Jefferson had died, they'd closed that loophole.

[evensgrey]

Only in his will, the only way he could. By the time Jefferson had died, they'd closed that loophole.

This is the kind of problems freeing slaves I was referring to.

Trying to bust Washington's and Jefferson's chops because they owned slaves that the State refused to allow them to free is just stupid.  (IIRC, Jefferson at least was noted for doing everything he was legally permitted to do to avoid causing harm to his slaves himself.)

[MrBogosity]

This is the kind of problems freeing slaves I was referring to.

Trying to bust Washington's and Jefferson's chops because they owned slaves that the State refused to allow them to free is just stupid.  (IIRC, Jefferson at least was noted for doing everything he was legally permitted to do to avoid causing harm to his slaves himself.)

Including not having them do much work. He drove Monticello into the ground in the process.

[Lord T Hawkeye]

Washington and Jefferson both ran into legal difficulties freeing their slaves. For example, any freed slave could be captured and resold 12 months later.

It's things like this that which should make you wary of ANY attempt at deconstruction. Usually, as I've pointed out here, they're completely devoid of context and not at all sympathetic to the Catch-22s many of these people found themselves in.

You've mentioned before that slavers could purchase themselves and thus buy their own freedom.  Why couldn't he just sell the slaves to themselves for free?

[evensgrey]

You've mentioned before that slavers could purchase themselves and thus buy their own freedom.  Why couldn't he just sell the slaves to themselves for free?

Some states didn't allow slaves to buy their freedom, or be freed in other specific ways.  Since this was, legally, considered to be a matter or property law, it was exclusive state jurisdiction.  (And there was at least one state that specifically disallowed a freed slave to reside within it, and stated that any freed slave who remained within the state for more than a year after being freed forfeited their freedom and reverted to being a slave again, owned by whomever would capture them.)

Incidentally, the buying your freedom thing was often abused in places where it was allowed.  This was a common practice in the very similar system of slavery used in Rome, for instance, where a slave would usually not be able to accumulate the money to buy their freedom until they were old, effectively purchasing a replacement slave for their master.  A similar problem would tend to occur in any such system that allowed slaves to buy themselves.  (Besides, legally it makes no sense.  A slave has to be a legal chattel, and a chattel is definitionally not able to enter into any sort of contract.  Legally, it would be like you shoes buying themselves.)

[MrBogosity]

Some states didn't allow slaves to buy their freedom, or be freed in other specific ways.  Since this was, legally, considered to be a matter or property law, it was exclusive state jurisdiction.  (And there was at least one state that specifically disallowed a freed slave to reside within it, and stated that any freed slave who remained within the state for more than a year after being freed forfeited their freedom and reverted to being a slave again, owned by whomever would capture them.)

That would be Virginia, Jefferson and Washington's state.